CJ2K, Scaife and Tully all miss another set of VOLUNTARY workouts
Notice the key word up there?
about 2 years ago
August West
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So, they have voluntarily decided they hate their organization and don't care about their jobs!!!
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who are you to tell them how to live their lives!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
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I pay their salaries, so I am their boss!!!
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My personal Tribute to Air McNair
by T--Rac's Posse on May 11, 2010 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure you do.
My Bronco fan friends are gonna be really annoying this year.
by RareColoradoTitanFan on May 11, 2010 5:17 PM CDT up reply actions
most concerned about tulloch not being there.
cj2k i was expecting. dont know why or really care as to why scaife isnt there. but tulloch is only hurting himself by not being there. he needs this time, if he is gonna step up as the solidified starting mlb. i guess he wants an extended deal.
based on his tweet updates
he seems to be keeping himself in shape… unlike our last year’s first round pick.
that's the most important thing to me here
If they can keep themselves in shape, whatever. But there’s no excuse if anyone misses these workouts and shows up looking like Jamarcus Russell
"You know, we had a lot of fun tonight. But there's nothing funny about vapor lock! It's the third most common cause of cars stalling. So please, take care of your car and get it checked!" -Joe Namath
by billycthulhu on May 12, 2010 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
For Tully... it's standard practice for a guy under the Franchise tag, though.
With CJ… the organization has little leverage. He did this last year, got grief, and promptly made himself the best player in the League. Of course he’s doing it again.
Scaife is in an odd situation. I can appreciate why he’d be pissed since he probably could have signed a decent long-term deal last season, but that ship has sailed at this point. And if Jared Cook has a breakout season, Scaife could become expendable. I don’t particularly think Scaife will get cut, but he was well-served to sign his tender last year, and I think he knew it. That was a lot of money.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
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just read that vy has a new agent.
i wonder if we should read more into it. like a possible long term negotiation to relieve some titans cap, thats if we even get a salary cap back. i think we will. personally i think if uncle bud is willing to pay vince the money he is gonna get paid thru his rookie contract, we should see how he pans out in the next two years before we just resign him to a new long term deal.
If he plays well and the CBI gets worked out, he'll probably be looking for something soon.
The organization is going to have to do something with his contract sooner or later, i.e. Keep him or let him go. Even if that’s two or three years down the road, having a more professional agent now is probably the right move.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
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Why have a voluntary workout. Why not, make them all mandatory?
I realize CJ is keeping up with his training, but why not do it with the group and build team morale.
I am a humble fan, a great humble fan.
The NFL only allows so many mandatory workouts.
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And by NFL, I think I mean player's association
Either way, it’s not up to the team.
Official MCM Hater!
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yup: The CBA limits teams to a certain number of workouts in the off-season
otherwise these psycho coaches would have them out there 365 days a year.
Music City Miracles blogger and official Jon Bovi tour manager.
They should cut Scaife for not being there
For the money they are paying him he should be cleaning up the building every night.
Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles even though gramsey hates it.
"What if I was Peyton Manning?"- CJ to the ref after they picked up a personal foul flag for a late hit on him.
But then you wouldn't be able to wear your Scaife jersey anymore....
Official MCM Hater!
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Jimmy loves Bo Scaife.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
Charter Member of the Music City Miracles Hall Of Fame
Does anyone really think we would miss Scaife if he wasn't here?
If you answer yes, please back it up with some evidence.
Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles even though gramsey hates it.
"What if I was Peyton Manning?"- CJ to the ref after they picked up a personal foul flag for a late hit on him.
Yes. In this offense, we would.
The reason lies in his ability to be an effective blocker. It doesn’t show up in the stat sheet, but having a pass blocking TE is huge in this offense. 4 WR sets are nearly non existent in our system, which means that at all times you’ve got one/two TE’s and/or a FB.
I have my suspicions that Jared Cook can’t find the field because he can’t figure out how to block correctly. And, when you’re running a lot of zone run plays, it’s not as simple as ‘block the man in front of you’. As of the end of the season, Jared Cook is currently listed as third on the depth chart behind both Scaife and Stevens. That’s nuts, especially considering how great he allegedly looked in camp/practice. The only reasonable explanation that he can’t get blocking down correctly in practice.
Scaife fills a need because he’s somewhat of a hybrid. He’s not an elite blocker or receiver, but he’s very good at both. So, while people love to gush over Antonio Gates/Dallas Clark/Jason Witten, it’s important to understand that they are a different type of player than Bo.
With him gone, I fear that our running game could really suffer, and it would leave us a lot more transparent with Stevens in on obvious rushing downs and Cook in on passing downs. Cook is the future, but until the coaching staff is comfortable enough with him blocking/running the plays correctly, Scaife makes this team better.
In fairness, Gates, Witten, and Shockey (whom you didn't mention) all block very well.
They simply have other skills, too.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
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Craig Stevens can block
and we aren’t paying him $5 million to be talking about the Nuggets on the radio.
Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles even though gramsey hates it.
"What if I was Peyton Manning?"- CJ to the ref after they picked up a personal foul flag for a late hit on him.
That's true.
I guess my question back to you would be, why cut him? Is it his attitude that bothers you? Do you think it’s affecting the locker room?
Because cap room clearly isn’t an issue. If we were in cap trouble, maybe I’d take a slightly different stance. As it is now, we’re overpaying for a guy without consequences.
Craig Stevens is a good blocker. I just think that he’s too one dimensional. Scaife presents an opportunity to field a guy that can block and catch well. We need that until we have a better understanding if Cook can be an every down player in this league.
It pisses me off that Scaife is acting like he is being mistreated
Official MCM Hater!
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^This
Plus it makes me angry that so many people think he is good. I also don’t think they should give him a bunch of money just because cap room isn’t an issue.
If they really want to be fair, they should swap his money and CJ’s. Just pull The Switch.
Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles even though gramsey hates it.
"What if I was Peyton Manning?"- CJ to the ref after they picked up a personal foul flag for a late hit on him.
"Good" is hard to quantify.
But, I think we’re getting a little side tracked. Regardless of what’s fair, I think it’s hard to argue that this team would be better with one of our back ups. I think the fact that he didn’t show up to voluntary workouts is getting blown out of proportion. Extending his contract further than a year would have cost a fortune. Because of this, I think we were given a binary decision a) franchise tag or b) let him go. The TE position is too important to this offense to roll the dice on Cook, so they were forced to re sign him.
This
Yes, he was overpaid in 2009 and he was overpaid in 2010. I’m kind of annoyed at him not showing up to minicamp, so he’s probably making more between 2009 and 2010 than he would have been guaranteed by another team if he had signed with somebody as a free agent after 2008. But, the alternative to franchising him was overpaying Ben Watson on the FA market.
A better thing to do might have been to keep Ben Hartsock, rather than signing Crumpler-not as good a blocker, but a guy who could be more of a receiving threat so you’re not as screwed if Scaife leaves. After Troupe busted, they didn’t add another young guy until they took Stevens, so there was no in-house replacement, especially with Dinger’s 2-TE sets. If you like, blame Ben Troupe for leaving us in this position.
So we are screwed if Scaife leaves
why? Because of his blocking? I guarantee you they can find someone else to do that for cheaper.
Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles even though gramsey hates it.
"What if I was Peyton Manning?"- CJ to the ref after they picked up a personal foul flag for a late hit on him.
It's the combo of blocking and receiving
Making up numbers: Scaife’s maybe a 6 as a receiver and a 5 as a blocker. Crumpler was 8 as a blocker and 4 as a receiver. Stevens may be a 7 as a blocker and a 4 as a receiver. Cook may be as a 5 (and could easily be better) as a receiver and a 2 as a blocker. Random cheap free agent TE is maybe a 6 at one and a 2 or 3 at the other.
I’m not saying I like it, and I wish it hadn’t happened, but franchising Bo the last two years is the least worst decision in terms of putting the best team on the field. I also think if Cook had had a half-decent rookie season, they let Bo go. But he didn’t, and you’re left in a world of All Options Suck.
yes.
hes our best tight end. period.
My Bronco fan friends are gonna be really annoying this year.
by RareColoradoTitanFan on May 11, 2010 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Until Cook proves he can actually play
and that he isn’t just Ben Troupe 2: Electric Boogaloo, then we need a proven TE, especially someone who has such a good repore with Vince.
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by TitanFan2K on May 11, 2010 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
My thoughts exactly.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
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Rec'd for the Electric Boogaloo reference
Official MCM Hater!
"If anyone asks you, you fixed my television. Now go!"
Scaife is easily replaceable.
I am a humble fan, a great humble fan.
wrong...
tulloch is an excellent player and someone we really need to step up this year. scaife isn’t easily replacable either though. but i believe craig stevens is our answer for a blocking te and cook is our answer for a recieving te. guys like clark, witten, and davis are known as recieving te’s. with that being said, you would think they would get special consideration and coverage, but yet they still stack up yards game after game. why should cook be any different.
tulloch???
no patrick willis is excellent, jon beason, ray lewis, demeco ryans….tulloch is not on par. whats wrong with you people??? i watch every titans game i possibly can (when i’m not offshore) so unless he’s lights out during the games i miss…..i don’t get it…i would love for him to become a pro bowler but all i see is an average mlb…..
There must be a lot of people who have something wrong
Because you are clearly in the minority. Like, the only one in the minority.
Official MCM Hater!
"If anyone asks you, you fixed my television. Now go!"
wrong...
Ryan Fowler is easily replaceable.
Keyword "Another"
Media - "How does it feel to be that fast?"
CJ - "It feels real good."
by nathangouge on May 11, 2010 9:24 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Voluntary?
Look, these sessions are only “voluntary” in that the players can’t be fined for missing them. In every other respect, they are mandatory. The coaches expect the players to be there, and the players expect their teammates to be there (even though they typically won’t say it publicly, except in the case of Big Al).
No, CJ did not do the same thing last year. He skipped the off-season conditioning program but not the OTAs. That’s entirely different. It’s one thing to think your personal coach is going to prepare you as well as Steve Watterson (although that’s probably wrong too), but it’s entirely different to think you or the team is better off by your missing these mini-camps where the team is working on FOOTBALL (not stretching, weightlifting, and such) together. That is selfish.
For the RFAs, it’s a little different story. They are not under contract until they sign their tender. By refusing to sign their tenders, they can force the club to pay them 110% of last year’s salary, sign them to a new extended contract, or release them on June 1. DannoE alluded to this above: since Scaife was paid a very large amount in base salary as the franchise player last year, he stands to make a lot under the 110% rule. Does anyone know how Tulloch’s tender compares with his salary last year?
I thought Tulloch got the franchise tag.
Anyway, I remember that he was looking at a pretty significant one-year figure this year, but that he called it “a good start” and still wants a longer term deal. On the team side, I can imagine that they’d be willing to do a deal—but not a blockbuster deal by any means—to keep Tulloch around. Which probably explains why he’s looking to get paid the one-year thing right now.
DannoE
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
Storyteller's Playbook
Charter Member of the Music City Miracles Hall Of Fame
From what I can find...
The Titans did not use the franchise tag this year. That would be used to keep someone who would otherwise have become an unrestricted free agent. No one they lost this year was deemed valuable enough to pay him top-5 money which comes with the franchise tag.
They gave Tully a first-round tender which will pay him $2.5M this year. He has not signed the tender, but that is already more than 110% of what he made last year (something in the $500K range), so there is no reason for him to hold out.
Scaife was paid $4.46M last year as the franchise player, and he was tendered at $4.9M this year (110% of last year’s pay). He signed his tender in March, so he has no reason to skip OTAs.
Okay here's how this works
During the offseason the only thing any of these guys can do to get the attention of the FO is to hold out from mini-camps (which seemed to be used to ensure that everyone stays in shape). It has nothing to do with teamwork and teammates. The best case scenario for the player holding out is that the FO gets nervous and to absolve those insecurites gives the player a long term contract with lots of $$$. Holding out from minicamps is still a very empty threat because both the player and the FO are aware of the leverage at hand. The player doesn’t stand to gain anything by holding out a season of football and in most cases would severely hurt himself by holding out from training camp because of the hefty fines involved. This is most likely a set of fines the player doesn’t want to endure because if they are trying to improve from a $500,000 salary then taking $30,000 a day hits would start adding up fast. It’s unfortunate for these Titans’ players because the Titan Brass knows all of these games and has always had a steadfast hand when dealing with salary. They will downplay the absence of any player no matter how important they may seem. The only way I see their stance changing is if the locker room starts getting affected.
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