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8-7-1 The Jeff Fisher Story

It has recently become a debate on MCM as to whether Coach Fisher should be allowed to continue his streak as the longest tenured coach in the NFL. Some fans think he is one of the top five coaches in the NFL, others think he was but the game has passed him by. But was he ever really a top five coach? Is he really a top five coach today? Well the answer is obvious, No.

With a career record of 133-114, Fisher has a career winning percentage of .538(which happens to be the same as former Raiders and Bucs coach Jon Gruden.) But if you take a look inside those numbers you will see that without Steve McNair as his starting quarterback he is 54-57, for a .486 winning percentage. However, we cant hold it against Fisher that McNair was his quarterback so we have to allow McNairs career record as a starter for the Titans(79-57, .580 winning percentage) to count towards Fishers overall record.

Star-divide

Now we have to ask ourselves is a .538 winning percentage acceptable? Is that a winning percentage that would allow a coach to be considered one of the best in the game? Sure, if the coach has won a Super Bowl. New York Giants coach Tom Coughlin entered the 2009 season with a .536 win percentage(which is now slightly higher if you add in this years record so far.) He is considered one of the best in the game, but he has won a Super Bowl.

Former Vikings and Cardinals coach Dennis Green had a 97-62 record in his ten seasons as Vikings head coach(thats a .610 win percentage) and led his team to eight playoff appearances, but was fired with one game remaining in 2001 after his team went 5-10. He had a 4-8 playoff record for the Vikings and never made it to a Super Bowl. From 2004-2006 he served as the Arizona Cardinals head coach, went 16-32 and was canned. He finished his head coaching career with a record of 117-102(playoffs included) for a .534 win percentage. Green went nine straight seasons in Minnesota without a losing record but was fired at the end of his one losing season. Is he a better coach than Jeff Fisher? Its a close call.

What about Jacksonville Bedazzlers coach Jack Del Rio? Is he a better coach than Fisher? His career win percentage says he is. Entering 2009 Del Rios record? 45-35, a win percentage of .563.

Now, lets go a step further. We know Fishers career win percentage is .538, but what does that translate into as far as record? Thats easy, 8-7-1. Which pretty much sums up Fishers career with the Tennessee Titans. In his 15 full seasons he has led his team to six 10+ win seasons, five losing seasons, and four 8-8 years(never has his team posted a 9-7 record). That means 39.99% of the time his teams make the playoffs, 33.33% of the time they have a losing record, and 26.66% of the time his team finishes at .500. This does not sound like the resume' of someone who would be considered as one of the best at his profession. If someone said," Hey, hire this guy. He makes the playoffs twice every five years," would you accept that? You would if you accept mediocrity.

Here is a list of six out-of-work Super Bowl winning coaches(in no particular order) and one non Super Bowl winner. None are probably interested in cleaning up Fishers mess, but given the option who would you choose?

Jon Gruden career record 95-81, .540 win percentage

Tony Dungy career record 139-69, .668 win percentage

Mike Holmgren career record 161-111, .592 win percentage

Mike Shanahan career record 146-91, .616 win percentage

Bill Cowher career record 161-99-1, .623 win percentage

Brian Billick career record 80-64, .556 win percentage

Marty Schottenheimer career record 200-126-1, .613 win percentage

[UPDATE from Jimmy]- Poll added.  Anyone who chooses Billick will be immediately banned from the blog.

Poll
Which coach would you choose?
John Gruden
28 votes
Tony Dungy
101 votes
Mike Holmgren
19 votes
Mike Shanahan
46 votes
Bill Cowher
96 votes
Brian Billick
7 votes
Marty Schottenheimer
20 votes

317 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 34 comments

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Media fed

I think Fisher is considered such a great coach because he is known to be a class act. I think everyone in the league likes him including the media so no one wants to say anything negative about him.

Now, I have to admit to being one of those people. I just like the guy. You’re right about his record, but when it comes down to it he’s likeable, and quotable. He makes you want to believe he can bring the wins.

BTW, I wouldn’t want any of those coaches except for Dungy and he wouldn’t come.

by theologic on Oct 24, 2009 8:38 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Dungy

Looks like a gigantic penis with ears, and is vastly over-rated as a coach. Let’s not forget how the term “One-and-Dungy” came about.

To only win one Superbowl in all those years with a QB like Manning and a personnel guy like Polian is not a sign of talent; Dungy’s a mediocre coach but the media loves him because he’s such a do-gooder. Personally I can’t wait for the guy to get off my TV screen on Sundays; I’m sick of looking at him and listening to him.

by BeansCarter on Oct 24, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

My choice

doesn’t necessarily mean that I think Fisher should be fired or that I like this coach more than Fisher, but I thought it was a neat poll.

I picked Holmgren because of his track record with turning quarterbacks into legends (Montana, Young, Favre). I think Shanahan’s case has been seriously hurt by the fact that McDaniels has turned that team around in Denver (with a shittier quarterback, no less).

Don’t think Dungy would ever come out of retirement and I think Cowher is similar to (but probably slightly better than) Fisher (in terms of philosophy and not necessarily coaching style) but with a Super Bowl win. That leaves Gruden, who won a Super Bowl with Dungy’s team in Tampa Bay (and then got progressively worse until he was fired) and Billick, who, as was noted, should never be voted for. Ever.

I do like Fisher, but you make excellent points about records. Glad someone actually put it all together with words and numbers. Nice post.

by TNTitans on Oct 24, 2009 9:41 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

All Excellent Coaches

but some were blessed to have HOF QBs for the majority of their successful years…Shanahan-Elway, Holmgren-Favre, Dungy-Manning. Dungy was an excellent coach, but how good would his won-loss record be without Manning?

As you mentioned, Grunden rode Dungy’s coat tails to the SB, Billick can thank his success to Randy Moss and Ray Lewis, and Schottenheimer is the equivalent of an older Fisher.

IMO, that leaves Cowher. Although like Fisher, he was a lot more passionate…at least outwardly.

Going forward, the best coach for this team is probably some coordinator I’ve never heard of….

by T Coleman on Oct 24, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dungy without Peyton Manning...

56-46, (.549) which is still better than Fishers career win percentage. And thats with Trent Dilfer and Shaun King as his QB.

by bull4real on Oct 25, 2009 8:36 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Considering who our GM is...

The most realistic options are Holmgren or Gruden, considering their history. And I’d take Holmgren way before Gruden.

Christie kicks it high and short...Gonna be fielded by Lorenzo Neal at the 25...He dishes it back to Wycheck...He throws it across the field to Dyson...

www.manningface.com

by Michaeltastic on Oct 24, 2009 10:50 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

compare the talent levels

For all the coaches you describe, you fail to compare the talent levels. Your biased post mentions that you hate to include McNair’s record with Fishers, but then fail to mention the other talented players around the other coaches.

Furthermore, you don’t mention the GM’s affecting the draft and FAs.

It is my understanding that Fisher is known as a great coach because he usually does a helluva lot with little. How much of that “little” is his decision is beyond me, though. (see that? that’s being open to both sides!)

by oilertitan on Oct 24, 2009 10:56 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Agreed...

like many stats, these numbers don’t begin to tell the whole story. Which one of these other coaches had to field a team at the Liberty Bowl and Vanderbilt?

by TNTitan89 on Oct 24, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Where?

Did I say that i hate to include McNairs record with Fishers? I was just stating the fact that without McNair, Jeff Fisher has a losing record.

Do I need to go break down Mike Holmgren without Brett Favre? What good would it do? Holmgren turned right around and made Hasselbeck a Pro Bowler.

As far as Fisher doing a lot with a little. Yeah he has, but I could just turn around and say in those years he had “a little” and did a lot, he was also playing a soft schedule issued by the NFL for his below average record the year before.

by bull4real on Oct 25, 2009 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My problems with this

1) Just because Denny Green got fired for one losing seasons after 8 winning seasons doesn’t make that firing correct, and thus a good reason to fire Fisher. Teams fire coaches all too soon all the time for dumb reasons. Minnesota hasn’t returned to the form Denny Green had them at since firing him either, so was it a good firing? Results say no, probably not.

2) Super Bowls on a coaching resume are highly overrated. is Jon Gruden a better coach because his winning percentage is the same but he has one Super Bowl? I say no. In a sample size of ability, the Super Bowl is just one game. In his, it was against his former team that run the same offense he designed and the defense destroyed it.

3) You need to include an “other” on the list. The only one I’d even consider is Gruden. The rest are past the optimal age for coaches. It is a proven statistical fact that after the age of 55, coaches and their performance steeply decline. Makes sense, considering it’s a high stress job. Who can handle that at 60 years old without some sort of decline from when they were 45?

by T--Rac's Posse on Oct 24, 2009 12:41 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

What's with all the morons picking Dungy?

I’d sooner nail my balls to a burning building then see him in a Titans cap.

by BeansCarter on Oct 24, 2009 2:39 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

yup, just because we want ag uy whos built 2 superbowl teams, a tonne of division titles, and helped grow peyton manning from the least clutch qb in the league to the most — were morons.

by mattd97 on Oct 24, 2009 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

no he wasnt necessarily responsible for it, but his laid back attitude and confidence in his players definetely helped manning along. theres no doubt that manning was better when dungy left than when he came. sure most of that is due to his natural growth as an athlete, but coaching and mentoring helps.

by mattd97 on Oct 25, 2009 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tough choice

between Dungy and Cowher-I voted for the Cowher

Life without knowledge is death in disguise

by Zoltan from Budapest on Oct 25, 2009 1:43 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

none of the above

I’d still rather have Fish. I think its insanity that people have turned on him all of a sudden. Where was all this hate 7 weeks ago? Everyone loved him and anyone who said anything bad about him woulda gotten chewed out. If anyone woulda talked about getting rid of him they probably would be banned. This notion that the game has somehow passed him by in 6 games and he cant coach anymore is so ridiculous. Nothing has changed with him. He’s still the same coach everyone loved and would defend to the death but now that we hit a rough patch everyone wants to look at the glass half empty. Nobody cared about his 5 losing seasons when we were 13-3 last year. Most woulda called him a genius last year and now he’s being compared w/ Denny Green. Child please. When has Fish ever had a stacked team? When has he had a team that you could point to and say “that’s the most talented team in the league, they should win it all”? I’d say never. I’m amazed at what he’s done with the level of talent he’s coached. Just remember, if Fish gets canned, he’s gonna move ahead of most, if not all the coaches in that poll on GM’s lists of who they’d like to hire as coach. You’ll miss him when he’s gone.

I'M DISRESPECTFUL TO DIRT!! CAN YOU SEE THAT I AM SERIOUS?
GET OUT OF MY WAY, ALL OF YOU. THIS IS NO PLACE FOR LOAFERS. JOIN ME OR DIE. CAN YOU DO ANY LESS?

by TitanFan2K on Oct 25, 2009 2:39 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Child Please? We are 0-6, the glass IS empty (just like the win column)

Dennis Green went to the playoffs eight out of ten years. I was using him as an example to show that coaches with higher win percentages have been fired for less.

So now Fisher should be excused for losses because he has never had a stacked team? You lost me there. He returned 20 of 22 starters from the best regular season team in the NFL last season and is 0-6 today. I guess that qualifies as doing a little with a lot.

He may move ahead of those coaches, your right. Depending on the roster of the team looking for a coach. But I dont think you pick Fisher over Shanahan if you are trying to groom a QB. Or Dungy if your trying to build a defense. Every coach has a strength and a weakness. Smart GMs will staff accordingly.

And honestly. I do miss Jeff Fisher. Where did he go?

by bull4real on Oct 25, 2009 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

its not that fisher is no longer a good coach, its that hes no longer the right coach.

by mattd97 on Oct 25, 2009 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

fisher sucks

i have never liked his style of coaching. he just stands with his arms folded on the sidelines like he don’t care whether we’re winning or losing. i thought we always needed someone with more emotion. and the style of his teams is so boring to watch and only halfway decently effective. i mean playing defense against the run always and hardly ever blitzing and running the ball all the time is so boring to watch. we were the best team last year cuz of our easy schedule we were a mediocre team at best and that showed when we got to the playoffs.

by TitansFanForever on Oct 25, 2009 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

None of the above.

Official MCM Hater!

Retire #9!

by gramsey712 on Oct 25, 2009 3:18 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

thanks for the help guys, its always welcome

by mattd97 on Oct 26, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't understand.

How is it helpful to pick from one of the same old unsuccesful retread coaches?

Official MCM Hater!

Retire #9!

by gramsey712 on Oct 26, 2009 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

its not necessarily, however you could say ‘we should look at a dc or oc or some 30-year old wunderkid whos never played the game’. just crapping on the guys poll isnt providing any insight or entertainment, so whats the point

by mattd97 on Oct 26, 2009 5:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

stop taking it so personally dude

I don’t want anyone on your poll. It’s a simple solution. Put one of the options as… wait for it… OTHER. That way you give me a chance and I don’t have to take a big ole dump on your poll.

by T--Rac's Posse on Oct 26, 2009 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

my bad, just saw you didnt make the poll

change a couple of pronouns though and I stand by what i said

by T--Rac's Posse on Oct 26, 2009 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we cut ties with Fisher

I do not think we need to bring in an old retread. However from the coaches you offer in your poll I voted Cowher. i think his style is a lot like Jeff’s which I actually like. The old school run the ball down your throat and play great D. It is just power football at its best. Another reason I picked Cowher is that if he were to take over this team there is not going to be a 2-3 year window waiting to draft his style players before we would see a turn around. Besides the QB, position we are built quite a bit like his teams of the past. One las note Cowher has passion and a fire that burns deep inside. I remember all the closeup views of him on TV chewing his players and spit flying. He would have gone ape shit in New England this year and that is what I think this team is missing.

by bullrider73 on Oct 26, 2009 11:37 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i say we get some new young blood like the steelers, ravens, or broncos have done.

tenured coaches have lost their touch on this new game of football. the league is going in a different direction. as you can see passing is the new trend in the nfl. if you look at the numbers, this year has the deepest pool of qbs. time for the titans to get on the bandwagon. we have a good run game, but it’s boring and easily predictable to base the whole offense around it.

by TitansFanForever on Oct 26, 2009 6:30 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

winning percentages mean little when you look at coaches who get teams stacked with talent – Dungy, Shanahan. Who puts Marty in any conversation of good coaches, he is the Al Gore of football. There is more to coaching than winning percentage. One can not separate the McNair era from Fisher. You have to admit that they helped each other in terms of careers. Fisher brought respect to a laughing stock organization from Houston. I thought the offense was boring back when Eddie George carried the ball 25 times right up the gut for 3 yards every ballgame. Fisher is just first class, all around. He isn’t flashy, impressive, trying to earn style points for fans with too much blogging time, or whinning and complaining that all the talent has gone – which falls upon the front office. The guy played for the Bears – he is just hard core, old style, smack yo mama football and I for one like it.

My dad told me when I was 8 years old, "Never hit a man while he is down... it so much easier to kick him!!!!"

by zanshin on Oct 27, 2009 2:14 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i disagree

There is not more to football, than winning. Thats why the game is played. not for stats, not for money. For the W.

No Fisher isnt flashy or impressive. And yes it got old watching Eddie carry the ball nearly 400 times per season. Maybe if Fisher wasnt so old school and had thought about using a 2 back rotation, 27’s career might not have ended so abruptly. The kind of football he coaches, and you like, kills players careers.

Numbers do not lie, not on the stat sheet, not in the win column, not in the phone book. You are your record. And I for one dont like it. Do you like that?

by bull4real on Oct 29, 2009 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it was Cower who put Fish off the playing field with the knee injury back in 1938!!! And he sucked as an announcer anyway.

My dad told me when I was 8 years old, "Never hit a man while he is down... it so much easier to kick him!!!!"

by zanshin on Oct 27, 2009 2:22 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

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