How Much Trust Does Jeff Fisher Have in Vince Young?

by Jimmy on Nov 13, 2007 10:17 AM CST in News

When the Titans played Carolina there was a possession where they were backed up inside their own 5 yard line. The Panthers had 14 men in the box (not really because that would be a penalty). The coaches called 3 straight running plays up the middle with LenDale White and punted. That got me wondering to myself and on this blog if the coaches trust Vince Young.

Fast forward to last week's game against the Jaguars. The Titans complete a pass to the Jaguars' 19 yard line with 18 seconds left on the clock. The Titans had 2 timeouts. Instead of calling a timeout right there and taking a shot at the end zone, Jeff Fisher elected to let the clock run down to 2 seconds and kick a field goal. That got me saying aloud to all of section 335 that the coaches just don't trust Vince. After the game Fisher said he wanted to make sure they got points out of that, but if you trust your quarterback you let him take one shot at getting a touchdown. If it is an incomplete pass you kick the field goal. If it ends up as a play that doesn't make it to the end zone you just call the timeout.

Vince was asking the same thing after the game. Jim Wyatt says in his article this morning that Vince wondered aloud "if the guys don't trust me." Of course Jeff Fisher is saying all the right things:

"I think everybody is a little frustrated at this point after a loss. I characterize that as just frustration after a loss,'' Fisher said. "We threw the ball 41 times, and that should imply that we trust what he is doing.''

I hear what he is saying, but I don't think he trusts Vince at all. The 2 examples above are a pretty good proof of that. This could be a really big problems for the Titans going forward. Vince Young won a lot of games for this team last season. The only way for him to be able to make those plays again is for the coaching staff to put the trust in him that he can make those plays.

The Titans need to work the no huddle offense into their game plan. They don't need to wait until they are down by a lot to start running it. Vince plays better and looks a lot more comfortable running the hurry up. I know that isn't Jeff Fisher football, and I am not suggesting that they should run the no huddle the entire game. What I am saying is that Fisher and Norm Chow need to compromise with the style of quarterback that Vince is. It is not very smart to take a quarterback at #3 overall and try to fit him something he isn't. Let him do what he does.

Whether you like it or not, Vince Young is the future of this franchise. The Titans cannot afford to have a riff between the franchise quarterback and the coaching staff. There is obviously at least a little riff there if Vince is asking the question. Fisher, Chow, and Vince need to sit down now and hammer this thing out before it grows into a bigger problem.

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Right now, VY looks...

...exactly like Drew Brees did in the year before the Chargers took Rivers in the draft. Schottenheimer was the coach, and with LT in the backfield, he put the SHACKLES on Brees, pounding the rock ALL THE TIME except when there was OBVIOUSLY no other choice. Brees threw a ton of picks that year, too, to the point where Schottenheimer DID bench him, in favor of then back-up, the 41-year-old Doug Flutie. To add to the similarities, the Chargers at that time had a monster D. In the end, the Chargers went to the playoffs but got busted out by the Jets in an awful home-field loss in OT following a missed FG by a previously unknown-turned-money kicker.

Now we have the benefit of a little hindsight.

Schottenheimer probably didn't trust Brees too much and wouldn't start trusting him until the next season, after they'd already drafted Rivers. By then, they'd built a solid Offense all the way around, because LT continued to be execellent and because they got TE Antonio Gates. But, bottom line, Schottenheimer liked to play a specific style of ball, and he was successful with it, and Brees was young and in a complicated offense. Like it or not, that trust had to be earned.
Gates was huge for Brees. Without the addition of Gates, and the confidence that comes with having a monster pass-catching TE to throw to, we could argue that Brees's career would have ended rather than blasted off.
For all his heroics earlier in his carreer, Flutie was ineffective as a Charger.

I'm sure there's more to learn in there somewhere.

DannoE

Go read FRIDAY MAD SCIENCE at www.paperbackreader.com
Thanks!

by DannoE on Nov 13, 2007 10:38 AM CST 0 recs

I think

the flow of the game was the reason Coach Fisher wanted points.

I feel that they finally let Vince go in the Second half! that is the game he needed to get confidence in himself and his WR's.

To many times he is trying to be the Well coached QB and take the check downs instead of taking the chance or just letting it go.

Maybe now we will see the offense open up some

by white02slpss on Nov 13, 2007 10:58 AM CST 0 recs

Fairly new fan

I've been a Titans fan for only a couple of years, I just moved up here so I am learning more and more about Fisher's style of play and what the Titans are all about. I didn't really understand our draft picks last year until someone at my office said that is Fisher ball. Then once he explained Fisher ball, I got why we drafted the way we did.

However, we don't seem to be a hurry up type of offense and why did we draft Vince if he clearly does not fit Fisher's style of play? I understand he's the franchise, and I don't think you put Kerry in there, but long term it looks like we've taken a young man who likes to play with a little less structure and we put him in a very smashmouth style of play. Even the coaches at Texas have said the less they coached him the better he got.

How do you guys think this plays out?

by BenP on Nov 13, 2007 11:13 AM CST 0 recs

I think it will work....

....because it worked with McNair. The more he gained Fisher's trust, the more Fisher let him do. I just hope it doesn't blow up before we get there.

Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles

by Jimmy on Nov 13, 2007 11:37 AM CST up 0 recs

I can agree with that

I'm not a huge VY supporter. I like him because he is our quarterback and that is about it. I prefer a much more traditional style of passer, but Fisher is the coach and I'm a fan and I'm cool with that.

As long as we are winning, that is the important thing. It does look like there are some growing pains in the passing game and he does need to get better, but I would think that its hard to not be on the same page with your receivers so often this late into the season. I mean they've been playing/practicing since March and it still looks out of sync.

Hopefully we can get Albert back and give Denver a steady dose Lendale.

by BenP on Nov 13, 2007 12:26 PM CST up 0 recs

I'd be curious

to see that VY quote in more context. Anyone know if the complete quote is out there?

by longtitan on Nov 13, 2007 12:05 PM CST 0 recs

I have tried to find it....

....but I haven't been able to yet.

Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles

by Jimmy on Nov 13, 2007 1:09 PM CST up 0 recs

Fisher doesn't trust VY...

and that's expected to an extent because he's a conservative coach, but Fisher's got to recognize that handcuffing Vince isn't working.

We did draft VY based on what he can do if we let him use 70% of his ability, we drafted him based on what he can do with 100% of his ability. It's time to treat the offense like we did when McNair won Co-MVP: take shots at big plays downfield, hammer the run game (but just not as much unless it's rolling), and let the kid make some mistakes.

He's a big play guy, not a precision machine, and handcuffing him is taking that away so that only the INTs and dump-off passes remain.

My name is August West, and I love my Pearly Baker best, more than my wine

by August West on Nov 13, 2007 1:23 PM CST 0 recs

its the wrs

I really think the reason they can't let Vince go is because the wrs will just put the ball on the ground. Or worse, tip it to the defense (86). They're not at all on the same page with Vince. Hopefully one day though...

ps i'll be at denver for the monday night game. can't wait. TITANS!

by EliCash on Nov 13, 2007 4:53 PM CST 0 recs

i may be wrong but i may be right.

maybe if norm chow got down on the turf instead of breaking tradition by sitting up stairs it would make a differce somehow?
everybody says norm chow is the geru of coaching qwarterbacks. i like to think that he is and he may be but the more coaching from norm chow vince gets the worse vinces performace.
i hope they open up the offence alot more and take more chances throwing the ball down field. i dont mean way down, 50 yarders, cus everytime they try one that long i have come to relaize that its eaither not caught or intercepted. has anybody else flet like that when watching on sunday tickeet that once vince launchs one down field and its out of the tv screen? when the ball is in flight i fell like oh god here goes a incompletion at best interception at worst. maybe come out passing for a change instead of running lendale into a wall over and over again.
this is how the offence seems lattley. come out and pass on fist down for a incomplete pass or run for a yard. run on second down into a wall of the opposing team like the jags at the line of scrimmiage. then get a penelity for a false start on 3 down so now they have 3 and 15. then vince trys to pass for the first down but ends up running and ends up 3 yards short.
why not come out pass pass and pass a few times. get those 8 out of the box change it up. i think fisher is smart and i dont know anything about coaching but i know what i see and its no offence as of late. they need to open it up get lendale out of there and if cris henery or brown get in there give them a shot. lendale is to overweight and cant get to the holes fast enough. everybody was jumping for joy when lendale jumped over a tackler at the caorlina game. it wasnt much of a jump cus he couldnt get his big body up in the air. chris henery on the otherhand seems to fly to the hole and is alot faster. i really liked when he flew threw the air to score that one touchdown after the long run a few games back. just my opinon or obersvation.
saw kevin gilbright on the sidelines as offence cordinator on the highlights few days ago. i kind of wish we had him back. i would like to see them come out with vince in the shot gun with 4 recivers spead out doing some run and shoot type of things just to change it up for a few series.

by dentureboy on Nov 13, 2007 8:59 PM CST 0 recs

It would also be funny....

....to bring back Buddy Ryan and watch them fight on the sideline.

Titans Blogger at Music City Miracles

by Jimmy on Nov 14, 2007 7:46 AM CST up 0 recs

at least

We'd be 12-4!

by white02slpss on Nov 14, 2007 9:08 AM CST up 0 recs

I know its really frowned upon in the NFL

but how about some good ole' college option. Or atleast some plays where Vince has the option to run, pass, or throw. I know we do that out of the shotgun sometimes but I feel that Vince should get out of the pocket and then have that option.

by nvemvp23 on Nov 13, 2007 9:44 PM CST 0 recs

That might work

but then you'd be getting away from what your offense is about just accommodate your quarterback. And maybe that is what they need to do. Do you change the system to help your quarterback perform or do you teach your quarterback to fit your system or do you get a guy that does fit your system.

I may be way off and VY and Vick are by no means the same, but it seem for years that they tried to make the offense fit Vick because Vick couldn't fit the system. I dunno.

Hopefully he will get better, and he is still young. But I do like it when we pound the ball and play solid defense. Those are our strengths and the things we like to do. We don't need Vince to be spectacular, just make some plays here and there when given the opportunity and we will be fine.

by BenP on Nov 14, 2007 9:50 AM CST up 0 recs

lots of things

they could try to shake it up a little on offense, and I'd like to see some of the things you guys are suggesting.

Denver has an 8th ranked passing defense and a 31st ranked rushing defense though, so I'm not banking on seeing them hurl the ball a lot or trying to spread the field early Monday night. If the run game is working we could very well be seeing under 20 pass attempts again.

by numbertenox on Nov 13, 2007 10:40 PM CST 0 recs